Thursday, December 13

Could Skyhawks form a privateers' Air Force?

Well, why not?

Given that it's now obvious that no other Air Force is either able or willing to buy NZ's former Air Force Skyhawks; and given that they've now been shrink-wrapped in latex  so they can be parked outside in the rain; and given that they've cost taxpayers $8 million to store since the Clark Government decided they didn't have a country worth defending and didn't need a fighter wing to defend it ... given all that, why not sell the machines to enthusiasts around the country who already own several of the world's great fighter jets, most of whom are considerably more patriotic than the ministers of the Clark Government, and all of whom realise that a country like ours is worth defending and desperately in need of a rational defence policy-- and would probably be only to happy to have their planes used  as part of a privateers' Air Force.

How 'bout it?

Congratulations to Heather Roy for the suggestion.  Hat tip to Whale Oil for the news. Tags: ,

Labels: , ,


Anonymous Sus said...

In true league-fan style: "Maaaate!"

13 December 2007 at 15:09  
Anonymous Flyboy said...

These aircraft are A-4K Skyhawks. The "K" designation means they have been fitted with modern avionics kit from the latest of the F-16s. That means they have HOTAS (hands on throttle and stick) complete with side-stick control and all the weapons guidance & delivery systems from the F-16 as well. Hence these aircraft can't be easily sold.

Don't forget that the NZ govt is a signatory to the Wassenar Agreement. The A4K has several of the items mentioned on the critical technologies list appended to that agreement. Consequently it would require the US government (and others) to agree to any sale of the aircraft. They would need to approve of the purchasing party. One could surmise that the US do not want just anyone to get hold of their ordinance guidance technologies!

It appears that several individuals (some ex-RNZAF) have already approached the govt about a sale, only to be told that the avionics kit would need to be removed. That's a major job which would probably cost more than the value of the airframe (assuming you can still get all the parts to restore those aircraft to steam guage instruments and control).

A private airforce would be a good idea but the government is hardly likely to countenance that- especially when the owners of said private airforce might well conclude that the government is itself a threat to the nation.


13 December 2007 at 16:11  
Blogger PC said...

You make two excellent points, Flyboy.

The first is disappointing to hear.

The second is revealing.


13 December 2007 at 18:31  
Blogger Oswald Bastable said...

There is something disturbingly Freudian about those planes wrapped in latex!


13 December 2007 at 19:43  
Blogger Rebel Radius said...

I would fart in public for a ride in one of those babies!

13 December 2007 at 20:40  
Blogger libertyscott said...

If not for military, strip them done so you can fit a compartment for a passenger (and bog) and fly wealthy businesspeople at Mach 2 across the Pacific. After all, you just need a bunk, air con, a bog, a drinks fridge

and before any aviation fans tell me why not, don't bother - I already know (range, FAA approvals etc etc), but I'm enjoying the sun in Manly and am entitled to such flippant fun while checking work emails.

13 December 2007 at 21:33  
Blogger KG said...

To a sex maniac, everything is disturbingly Freudian..;-)
Psych is showing patient Rorsasch blots.."now, what does this remind you of?"
Patient: huge boobs.
Psych: and this?
Patient:long, tanned thighs
Psych: ok, I've analysed your problem--you're a sex maniac.
Patient It's not my fault--you keep showing me these dirty pictures!

13 December 2007 at 21:38  
Anonymous Flyboy said...


A4 Skyhawks are ground attack aircraft (hence the lable "A" for attack and not "F" for fighter). They do not have Mach 2 capability.

No military fighter aircraft or ground attack aircraft have the ability to cruise at Mach 2. They cruise at sub-sonic speeds. The ability to go supersonic is a "dash" capability only. For example, at sea level the Tomcat can go supersonic for about 9 minutes before exhausting its fuel. At altitude it can stay supersonic for longer, but the capability is limited. With the exception of the F22 (which is able to supercruise at ~ Mach 1.4) the situation is the same for all military aircraft.

Concorde was a super achievement, one which has not been properly appreciated.


14 December 2007 at 06:46  
Blogger libertyscott said...

cheers flyboy, always good to learn more. I never profess to know much about military aviation

15 December 2007 at 08:09  
Anonymous Falafulu Fisi said...

Flyboy said...
With the exception of the F22...

Flyboy, is F22, the new stealth plane that is going to replace the F15 combat fighter? Is it operational yet or are they still developing it?

15 December 2007 at 08:48  
Anonymous Flyboy said...

Falafulu Fisi

The F22 Raptor is the air-superiority fighter. It supercedes F-16, F-15 and a number of other types. It is to dominate the air combat arena, demolishing any and all opposition set against it.

The airframe is "stealthy" and features low observability form allied to RAM (radar absorbent materials). A lot of detail design features (such as edge treatments for hull openings) is directed to eliminate radar return as far as possible. Weapons systems are conformal to aid performance and also to minimise return.

One major advantage for F-22 is its avionics kit. The radar system is a phased array type with significant on-board computing and analysis capability. It represents a two generational improvement over what has been fitted to previous fighter aircraft. The result is that the first evidence an enemy fighter encounters of an F-22 in the locale is his own death.

F-22 has super-cruise capability such that it can get to a combat area twice as fast as any other fighter aircraft (or bomber).

Flyboy does not recommend air to air combat against F-22s,even if you are flying a JSF.

16 December 2007 at 11:07  
Anonymous Flyboy said...

Rebel Radius

You have good taste. An A4 is a real pleasure to fly. Heineman's hot rod is agile and responsive. It remains impressive, even today. Heineman got it right (he even wrote a book about how to design aircraft like this one).

Fly it fast, fly it low!


16 December 2007 at 11:12  
Anonymous Michael Fasher said...

The f22 can super cruise without afterburners at up to mach 1.58.Its cobat radius is over 100 km with half the time at super cruise,The Australian airforce Mirage 3s demonstratedmach 1.3 super cruise as far back as 1963 with no external stores but most aircraft cant so in real terms the sky hawk isnt realy much slower than more modern aircraft

16 December 2007 at 16:16  
Anonymous Michael Fasher said...

Add another zero to that combat radius estimate

16 December 2007 at 16:22  
Anonymous Flyboy said...


How long can a Mirage 3 without external stores maintain M1.3?


16 December 2007 at 22:39  
Blogger Dazza44 said...

Sorry Flyboy but the A4K has nothing to do with the upgrade they had. A4K was the designation given to New Zealand Skyhawks back when they arrived in the early 1970's. K for Kiwi I believe.
From memory we got 10 A4K's and 2 TA4K's and later got 10 A4G's from Australia. All of those were upgraded to there present form.
It was a sad day when they were withdrawn from service.
I lived in Marton for 19 years and always smiled when the A4's and the old Strikemasters would fly overhead.

1 July 2008 at 18:00  

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