Who? Pastor Becky bloody Fischer, that's who, the former head of the 'Jesus Camp' documented in the film of the same name (hold on to your head, here's a trailer), and still head of KidsInMinistry.Com -- tagline, "redefining children's ministry in the 21st Century"! The exclamation mark, by the way, is mine. You'll understand why quite quickly.
Regarding what exactly Fischer means by "redefining children's ministry in the 21st Century" might look like, this fruitcake tells ABC News in a short news item about her 'Ministry' and the Jesus Camps her Ministry used to run (pre-film) for thousands of pre-teen Christians: "I want to see young people ... as radically laying down their lives for the Gospel as they are over in Pakistan and Israel and Palestine, and all those places..." I don't need to tell you how they lay down their lives (and others) in Pakistan, Israel and Palestine.In fact Fatah in Palestine just gave us another lesson in their brand of radicalism yesterday when they killed three children in a drive-by shooting. Radical, huh. As Voltaire observed, people who believe absurdities tend to commit atrocities.
But back to Beckie. And her young proteges. Says one of them, "You know, a lot of people die for God and stuff, and they're not even afraid." Says another poor sap, "We're kind of being trained to be warriors, only in a much funner way."! (There's another exclamation mark.) You see, Pastor Beckie is worried that America is-- as Bill Maher puts it -- "losing the Fanaticism Race," and she wants to indoctrinate young kids to join the nuts on the other side by abandoning reason entirely -- or just "kind of" -- and embracing .. well, what exactly ... martyrdom?
The line between different brands of dangerous religious nuts is only paper thin. If this is what Leonard Peikoff was warning about before the recent US election -- and I confess, I thought he was exaggerating -- then he was right on the money. These people are dangerous. "A specter is haunting America," says Peikoff, "the specter of religion."
"What does determine the survival of [America]," said Peikoff back in October, "is not political concretes, but fundamental philosophy. And in this area the only real threat to the country now, the only political evil comparable to or even greater than the threat once posed by Soviet Communism, is religion and the Party which is its home and sponsor."The only thing funny about it is that religious conservatives like O'Reilly can react with equanimity to Pastor Becky bloody Fischer, but so septically about a child actor making fun of religion and those "goddamn Christians." The kid's funny too (see below). But they sure ain't.
The Coolest 8 Year Old In The World Talks About O'Reilly
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And you can read more about Religion versus America at the Ayn Rand Institute Religion page.
LINKS: Jesus Camp - Wikipedia
Jesus Camp (trailer) - You Tube
Jesus Camp (ABC News) - You Tube [video]
Peikoff on the coming election - Capitalism Magazine (October 19, 2006)
Religion v America- Ayn Rand Institute
Bill Maher - Jesus Camp - You Tube [video]
The coolest 8 year old in the world talks about O'Reilly - You Tube [video]
Bill O'Reilly labels YOu Tube video as child abuse - You Tube [video]
RELATED: Religion, Nonsense
20 comments:
To me this highlights that 'Islamic extremism' is not a product of Islam, but of extremism. Ie, extremism comes in many forms, and blaming the particular vehicle is missing the point.
Oh, let me add, religion is a good starting point for extremists in that it allows irrationality and belief to triumph over reason, but that is only a means to an end for particular (extremist) members.
if only the Democrats really COULD fight this rationally and convincingly, but they are such moral equivocators they fail - miserably.
It is rather depressing, except that the NZ version recently folded and Brian Tamaki's one didn't make a tenth of the dent he said it would.
The problem is not "extremism," it is what one is extreme about.
There's nothing wrong with being extremely good, extremely talented, extremly productive etc.
The problem is not "extremism," it's faith, that "alleged short-cut to knowledge which ... is only a short-circuit destroying the mind."
Faith and force are corollaries, as Ayn Rand argues in this lecture, and as these Jesus Camp nutbars begin to make plain.
The only way to fight this faith-based muck is with a firm stand on behalf of reason and the values of the Enlightenment.
As you say, Scott, the Democrats are hardly in a position to adopt that mantle.
Well said PC.
Of course Peikoff has been saying religion was more of a threat than terrorism for years - I'm pleased you have seen the light.
No doubt you will get readers saying "Oh by what rational person would listen to this woman?" -- but in spite of neoconservatives being revealed as the ugly, crazed extremists that they are they still have Bush's ear and remain more or less firmly in control.
A muslim academic (he stands well clear of what he calls 'Islamists') I read mentioned how this current Pope, with his staunch conservativism, is an ideological ally of many Muslims today on a host of issues.
I've been saying that about the Catholic Church for some time.
you were making sence until you brought up Rand (the high priestess of Selfishness and Greed) who seems to be the end point of social, political, and moral though for some who read her as teenagers.
You don't need religion to be a good person. And lots of religious people are not good.
But just because you reject religion (like me), that is no reason to be an a-hole.
I watched Jesus Camp a few weeks ago, and it was very interesting viewing. I don't think it was biased at all; it simply told the truth. Unfortunately, the truth is a pretty scary picture. A few times on-screen Christians made statements that made me and my friend look at each other wide-eyed and go, "Whoa, do they really believe that?"
Apparently the Christians featured thought the film was fair and are going to use it as a proselytising tool ...
"You don't need religion to be a good person. And lots of religious people are not good".
That's the point.
"But just because you reject religion (like me), that is no reason to be an a-hole".
I know - I've been telling him that for ages.
I think September 11th was the beginning of the end of christianity and religion in the United States.That sounds wildly optimistic but in the early nineties only 3% of peaple declared that they had no religious affiliation whereas a recent survey indicated that it was 14% which would make it the third biggest denomination behind catholics(25%) and baptists(15%).
Wshington state had 28% non religious and oregon was 27%.
Richard Dawkins book The God Delusion has been number five on the New York Times best seller list along with The End of Faith by Sam Harris.
Those damn Christians, eh..flying planes into buildings, lopping the heads off Thai schoolgirls, gassing Kurds, taking schoolchildren hostage and then murdering them, blowing up school buses, taking aid workers hostage and then murdering them.
Oh wait! wrong religion....
(and no, I'm not religous at all. An atheist in fact)
To suggest that a few fringe nutters are in any way in the same category as these assholes is simply deluded.
I checked out a few of these, and in that horrible trick perpetrated by YouTube (more related videos popping up after the first one finishes) I ended up watching a few of them.
Sick to my stomach after that - telling kids to 'lay down their lives for the Bible' is absolutely insane any way you try and spin it. It does need to be remembered though that this Jabba-the-Hutt looking troll-lady represents only a fevered, tiny fraction of Christian opinion, and should be thought on as such (same as that Westboro Church bloke, the 'God Hates America' guy).
Scary shit though, nonetheless. I found the video where she encourages kids to come forward and be 'washed free of their sins' with a bottle of Nestle spring water to be particularly jarring - one of the comments pointed out the parallel emergent shady union between the corporate right and the religious right... 'Nestle saves!' Ah, but I digress.
Fundamentalist religion is fucked up, full-stop.
DenMT
BTW: KG, I can see you clearly find it hard to resist the opportunity to foment hatred of Islam anywhere you go, but try and it keep it in your pants on this one eh? You appear to be drifting off topic. How about you stick to posting fantasy images of Mecca being destroyed by a nuclear strike, or Islam with a fat swastika through it on your hate-blog - there's a good lad.
Just telling you what that nice Auntie Beckie is after , KG. Just reporting the news.
You think it's wrong to bother about Christian nuts, when the irrationalism is just as virulent?
The apostles, prophets, and Christ himself laid down their lives so that their fellow man could know the good news: the gospel of God's love and grace. This may come as a shock to you, but Christians have a bizarre habit of putting their faith into practice. It's almost as if they think it's true..!
"You think it's wrong to bother about Christian nuts, when the irrationalism is just as virulent?"
Not at all, PC. I find them repulsive. But it's also a matter of perspective--they don't control any countries and have almost no power, thankfully.
"BTW: KG, I can see you clearly find it hard to resist the opportunity to foment hatred of Islam anywhere you go"
Spot on. And I'll continue to do so as long as that ideology remains committed to destroying the West. As for "drifting off-topic"--the topic is religous extremism. Or do people like you automatically give every religion except Christianity a pass on that one?
The image of a nuclear cloud over Mecca certainly isa "fantasy", yeah.
Unfortunately, the Iranians don't regard images of a nuclear cloud over Israel as a fantasy at all. They regard it as inevitable. There's your dangerous religous nutters, denmt.
KG is right.
Ignore what people say.Watch what they do. The people you see in Jesus Camp are cringe-worthy (if cherry picked) but are really harmless (I'm agnostic, but my entire family are christians so I know of what I speak)
Islamic fundis on the other hand....
EXOCET
All religions believe in imaginary friends. However, in comparing Christian to Islam & others, Christian is the best in giving a hand to the desperate citizens of the world. Christian countries do donate aids on a massive scale to other poorer nations, in accordance with their belief in the old testament , "Thou shall give to your poor neighbours".
I could be wrong about this falafulu, but dosen't Saudi Arabia give a shitload of aid?
"I could be wrong about this falafulu, but doesn't Saudi Arabia give a shitload of aid?"
Is this what you mean by Saudi "aid," Anonymous?
PC said...
[Is this what you mean by Saudi "aid," Anonymous?]
No, that is a completely different type of aid. The types of aid , I am talking about are:
- Disaster Relief Aid.
- Education Development Aid
- Agricultural Assistance Programme Aid
- Community Development Aid (eg: Clean Water, Community Clinics, etc)
- ... and many more.
In the past I had been a receiver of such aids for things such as education books, new schools for the community, new roads, new hospitals. All those were from Western (or Christian) countries. None, whatsoever from any Muslim country.
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