tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11906042.post8626538240548928531..comments2024-03-18T17:17:00.423+13:00Comments on Not PC: Trading with Saudi ArabiaPeter Cresswellhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/10699845031503699181noreply@blogger.comBlogger5125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11906042.post-73122604303740589002015-05-01T09:48:20.323+12:002015-05-01T09:48:20.323+12:00Sam - I think you're missing the point. No-on...Sam - I think you're missing the point. No-one is saying that trade is a silver bullet that fixes all ills. But trade certainly exposes a backward society to outside influences and pressures that gradually erodes away at the worst of them. The fact we are even talking about the Saudi brutalities in the context of the trade deal is an example of exactly that. That erosion can be a very slow process, especially when the political elite control the worlds biggest oil source as they do in Saudi Arabia. But you can only evade reality for so long. I liken it to a drip from a tap falling into a bucket. Each drip may seem to have no affect, but eventually the bucket will overflow.<br /><br />If you doubt this than consider the precarious grip the Communist Party now has in China as a result of opening their economy up in recent decades to compete in the international market place, and the greater freedom the Chinese now have compared to say 40 years ago as a result.MarkThttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06199883270652041621noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11906042.post-44865696227044788982015-04-30T11:13:58.365+12:002015-04-30T11:13:58.365+12:00Saudi Arabia has been very wealthy and trading wit...Saudi Arabia has been very wealthy and trading with many countries for a long time; the culture is fundamentally the same as it always was. How long should it take to get their act together?<br /><br />There is a lot more to a culture than free trade or economics. Believing that open trade will change barbaric cultures is a naïve pipe dream. Those 19th century economists quoted probably never visited a non-European country.Samnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11906042.post-9633831053017201482015-04-30T04:38:57.508+12:002015-04-30T04:38:57.508+12:00I think there's two other reasons the usual su...I think there's two other reasons the usual suspects on the left are against this. One is that it's being initiated by Key (and they're against whatever Key does, now trying to twist the knife and finish him off on the back of hair-gate). The second is that it's potentially a free trade deal (and they're against free trade). The barbarity of Saudi culture are just convenient points to base their argument on.<br /><br />As you point out, opening trade up will generally (in the long term) work against rather than encourage barbarity - but that's something most on the left are incapable of recognising. A similar principle applies when you open up immigration from non Western cultures - but that's something many on the right are incapable of recognising. Both fail to recognise that when you have freedom the power of the good trumps the power of evil.MarkThttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06199883270652041621noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11906042.post-69283886813278464682015-04-29T10:32:41.881+12:002015-04-29T10:32:41.881+12:00Yes, very true. Compare still-authoritarian Cuba w...Yes, very true. Compare still-authoritarian Cuba with Vietnam, where the values of the marketplace permeate the place.Peter Cresswellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10699845031503699181noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11906042.post-68863849471428312462015-04-29T10:21:52.956+12:002015-04-29T10:21:52.956+12:00Always thought the US should have offered to trade...Always thought the US should have offered to trade with Cuba years ago. Fidel wouldn't accept I guess, but if he had the central/south american situation would have settled. Even if Fidel hadn't accepted, the flow would have changed throughout the area.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com